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Author Topic: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014  (Read 77234 times)

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Offline ford1

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #795 on: March 20, 2018, 06:34:49 PM »
I just have to shake my head in disbelief . how can the board expect us to be responsible & honest when they are clearly not . to say its already sorted,historical or they cant relook at it is just frankly bullshit . we also have to remember that there are current board members & staff that were employed at the time that this total wank went on so how does it look that no one was held responsible ? so fess up , pay up ( at least to the tune of the mans home ) just employ one less ex copper or I will happily pay a increased rego cost even though its the governments responsibility & write the man a formal apology until then I have to believe its the same old back door ,old boys , pillow bite funny handshake club it has always been . we as a industry will not move forward . I am ashamed to be part of it & try to steer away any young people who want to get involved . its well overdue to do the right thing



Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #796 on: March 20, 2018, 10:46:21 PM »
Thank you Ford 1

The thing is....you cant argue with corrupts, only against them....or its a sham.....and believe me it is most definitely a sham.....come on PGDB take me to court for slander.....you are as dodgy as* (as a perpetual board),   

*disclaimer for so called legal reasons....if you help to suppress corruption then you are party to that corruption....up to your f****ing neck!

Now you would all know how free they are with our money in chasing after slanderers....using the lawyers we pay for to keep us in check.....well here you have it.

If you stand by this bullshit.....YOU      ARE     CORRUPT, TOTALLY CORRUPT......take me to court you dodgy cunts.....they know this is here, I have sent them the link.





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You can't choose who you are.....but you are the sum of your choices.......

Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #797 on: March 28, 2018, 03:37:45 PM »
This is how ridiculous it has got.......have a read of the emails below, it is embarrassing...these people govern us...I will attach the PGDB letters in the next post...

How can you excuse your self from answering someone and give a multi choice answer....I would have thought using my "shit always runs down hill" logical mind....you would specify which one A, B or C....


Can you imagine telling your missis...No Luv I can't hang out the washing because it is either torrential rain out there, a small tornado is present or I just saw a large predatory bird circling, calling my name.....I am pretty sure she'd want to know which EXCUSE you were actually using...(option D is nearer the truth...I just don't want to do it)......





________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2018 8:01 a.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Winston Peters'; 'Kaitlin Ruddock'
Subject: RE: PGDB reply to my complaints 2018 03 13

Martin,

Please can you or Peter Jackson clarify whether my complaint is trivial, frivolous or vexatious? It can not be all three.

It smacks of the PGDB’s willingness to hide behind policy and rolling out yet another policy to cover this up? Just as you are with my other complaints “falling out side” of the general complaints policy. They are still very valid complaints, if you don’t have a policy to cover it, then make one.

I believe to cover up a near fatal explosion, while protecting the guilty, ignoring huge conflicts of interest, all done at the expense of the innocent, whilst telling untruths to the persons lawyer who was injured in that explosion while he lay in a drug induced coma, done to cover up the PGDB’s maladministration of the certificate system and the flippant handing out of full certifying licenses to the unqualified….totally despicable if not corrupt. That’s my policy and it should be everyone else’s policy that is copied in to this email….or you are happy with this? Are you happy with that long winded sentence, I will take your silence as a yes.

I can prove all of the above, and am happy to provide. It is not trivial, frivolous or vexatious to speak the truth to those that choose to ignore it.

It is not trivial to blow someone up, it is very serious. To want this PROPERLY looked into is not frivolous (the PGDB ignoring 9 people of interest at the hearing). It is not vexatious, I believe it is quite important, even imperative to get to the bottom of this, to expose those covering this up is not stirring up trouble for the sake of it…..its called seeking the truth with integrity and accountability.

I believe the PGDB treated this situation as trivial, by ignoring the huge amount of evidence. The PGDB is to be found acting in a frivolous manner toward a very important duty entrusted to them to protect the NZ public and displayed a nature of being vexatious when they pursued me in the local press after I went 42 out of 44 charges at their kangaroo court as an innocent man (the last charge being utter B.S.).



But it appears these three words only apply to us lowly plebs and not the hypocrites that govern us.




Yours with Integrity Paul Gee





________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 27 March 2018 5:03 p.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Winston Peters'; 'Kaitlin Ruddock'
Subject: PGDB reply to my complaints 2018 03 13

Hi All,

I will let you all decide if my complaints are trivial, frivolous or vexatious as per the letters sent by the PGDB in response to the email below and received by me today….it involves a cover up of a near fatal explosion and the dire state of the gas certificate system and flippant issuing of licenses to people shown preference by the PGDB whilst others more deserving are refused.

I remake these complaints under natural justice or any policy that I need to, to allow you look at this and not cover it up. It is so wrong to cover this up, just plain wrong.

Yours with Integrity Paul Gee

________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 13 March 2018 1:19 p.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'Chris Griggs'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'
Subject: RE: OIA request for Handwriting report

Martin,


Please take my email below as a complaint on the use of one of my warnings to pin the near fatal explosion on me (the outrageous outline is found below in my email please regard ALL questions as a complaint)……


So to recap…..


1.   I complain about the ethics on utilising my warning to try to pin the signature on me for the dodgy certs, that those warnings mentioned.

2.   I complain about the person who caused the fire mentioned below.

3.   I complain that Darnley may have been issuing his own certs.

4.   I complain that the PGDB is protecting Darnley.



I would add to that complaint your inaction to this email below. I am of the opinion after reading your policy, that my complaining about your inaction, removes you Martin from dealing with that complaint and ensures it goes before the Board. Just as the PGDB needed to see the report by the Federation, it needs to deal with these complaints in light of this report.

I have attached the PGDB’s own policy on complaints and the report for your convenience and it is under that policy that I make these complaints.

I also guide you to your most recent available agreement, page 5 attached, with the minister (Nick Smith), are the comments about appeals under “Complaints and Discipline” not to be over turned done at all costs…ignoring natural justice?

The policies and agreements that the PGDB ignore at will, whilst pontificating to the public is sickening.

Was my case too late to meet these policies? Yes it was…..but common decency has always existed, along with ethics and natural justice…..do the PGDB need a rule book to show these aspects fundamental to a well meaning humanity?

Yours with Integrity

Paul Gee

________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Thursday, 15 February 2018 8:55 a.m.
To: 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'Chris Griggs'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Paul Warhurst'
Subject: FW: OIA request for Handwriting report

Martin,

Thank you for the recent handwriting report, attached…..please can you explain the ethics of the PGDB using one of my warning letters, attached (a letter warning about dodgy certs covering dangerous gas work) which was sent 5 years before an explosion nearly killed someone.

This letter was used by the PGDB as a reference document for a handwriting report (a very directed and focused report only on me only, done well before BOTH mine and Darnley’s hearing)  ….trying to pin that explosion on me. Really? Using my warning to try to implicate me for what I was warning about? Then withholding that report, not divulging it until now, after an OIA request?

Why wasn’t any of Darnley’s handwriting/doc’s reviewed….like the cert for the pizza oven (which the PGDB lost) or the actual job card that shows Darnley’s hand for the addition of the fryers that caused the explosion.


The use of this letter is nearly as bad as relying on child molestation case notes to prove probability in a plumbing context, nearly!



All the evidence is here for those who want to look in the email below and evidence attached.




While I have your ear, I am yet to hear from you about the gas caused fire in Nelson where I asked the question in an email, quoted below, on the 20th Jan 2018.

How many fires caused by a gas leak were there in Nelson on that date? This should narrow it down for you…..if there was no investigation (similar to mine) then why not? It made the Notifiable gas accidents report from Energy Safety attached, emphasis on notifiable. The reference I sent in early December was taken from this report.


I have also just recently found out from someone I trust, that Darnley….who most if not all evidence points to for the Milton Street explosion, and is probably involved in the fire above (please can you confirm)….that the reason he was visited (and as a result gifted his full certifying gas license by Hammond with no apprentice sat after one oral exam, by none other than the same Hammond appointed to investigate the explosion)……well he was making up his own certs….on an exemption license….whilst selling gas….(Hammond also lobbied for deregulation form a gas retailers point of view). Confused? Call me on it….I’ll fly up and walk you through the huge amount of evidence.

So to recap…..

1.   Please explain the ethics on utilising my warning to try to pin the signature on me for the dodgy certs.

2.   Confirm who caused the fire.

3.   Was Darnley issuing his own certs

4.   Why are you protecting this man



I have copied in a few PGDB email addresses as I want this email tabled to the PGDB board at its next meeting. I want the perpetual Board take ownership of this debacle, not sweep it under the carpet.

You talk about trust and integrity you inherit the past and leave a legacy for the future with your present.

Injustice is corrupting if it is accepted....even if it is ignored…… it eats away at integrity, opening the doors to the dismantlers of good, just like rust corrupting the integrity of an otherwise strong steel durable structure.....its no plan for the future. 

This is why we don't use this as a template for ongoing success, history tells us corruption ultimately fails and causes chaos.



Yours With Integrity

Paul Gee


________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Wednesday, 14 February 2018 2:42 p.m.
To: 'Allan Day'
Cc: 'Wal Gordon'; 'Colleen Upton'
Subject: RE: OIA request for Handwriting report

Hi Allan,

I have copied in Wal and Colleen so we can see it all in one place.

The sick minded people behind this used one of my “warning” letters so they could pin the signatures on the certificates on me….I distinctly remember that the investigator (investigator he was not) stated that it was all about the signature……ignoring all the different inks and different handwriting.

This two page letter was one that I sent to warn about my concerns over 5 years before the explosion…..mentioned in reference docs for report, i.e. a two page letter stamped 09 01 04 (stamped by the PGDB)…..the letter being dated 06 01 04, the three days difference for it to be delivered to the PGDB and is the only letter I sent around that time.

This letter submitted by the investigator as a sample of my signature to give to the handwriting expert …..if you look at the letter….my concerns were later shown to be very well founded and actually bang on.   



This report then goes on to raising doubt over my involvement, even saying the signatures were different and could have been copied by a skilled person (all be it doubtful)…..The investigator ignoring Darnley involvement totally (please see break down of my findings in my email to Wal).

Not forgetting this report was withheld and I have only just seen it.



Did I get a fair go?


All the Best

Paul







________________________________________
From: Allan Day [mailto:allan-day@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 16 January 2018 10:50 a.m.
To: Paul & Emma Gee
Subject: Re: OIA request for Handwriting report

Hi Paul
Thank you for including me into your email, please keep me advised as to the response.
I have been reading Wal's report/submission and I can tell you I find it upsetting at the injustice of those involved and the wheels with in wheels as they concealed and covered the truth.
Kind regards
Allan



On 15/01/2018, at 11:21 AM, Paul & Emma Gee <gspservices@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

Martin,
 
Please by way of an OIA request can I get a copy of the report from the forensic document examination and handwriting expert who the PGDB contracted to analyse documents for the investigation into the explosion at Milton Street.
 
It is the report that the PGDB were billed for 12 hours of consultation, examination and the resulting report for. The invoice from the handwriting expert was dated 20 September 2010, but as it was part of the investigation it should have been retained until the hearing which is within the 7 years limit.
 
I would have thought a copy would have been made available to me at the time, but it has never been passed on to me and I have never seen a copy. It is within 7 years to the hearing and I can assure you my request is neither frivolous nor am I being vexatious. I do not think the well worn excuse of it’s “too hard to find” is warranted either.
 
A man nearly died in a preventable explosion due to circumstances I had warned about for 6 years before that explosion. My family were terrorised and my life has been in turmoil since.
 
Please Martin do not continue this cover up. Please clear my name and give me my life back. I have done no wrong but my family has paid a hefty price.
 
Thank you
 
Yours with Integrity
Paul Gee


Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #798 on: March 28, 2018, 03:41:55 PM »


I suppose we should have a policy as an Industry to not be governed by numpties....

Check out the letters in reply to  my email below....this is the sort of level of governance we are funding...

See no Evil, Hear No Evil, Speak no Evil.......especially when its your own Evil......I would rather have the monkeys to be honest.




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Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #799 on: April 02, 2018, 07:56:21 AM »

Apply the story on this link to what happened to me.....I have been saying it for years now.....and it will get worse....a housing shortage with an open market mentality, profit before standards (not by all, just the greedy) and you WILL MOST DEFINITLY HAVE A PROBLEM....


.....AND THOSE THAT GOVERN US ARE TO BLAME.


https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/102664221/wave-of-dodgy-building-materials-sparks-mbie-review

You need to address the mistakes of your past to be able to have a stable future, you can't built strong futures on dodgy foundations

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Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #800 on: April 02, 2018, 08:01:41 AM »


Ask your self who would be more inclined to try to be dodgy......those who think they are connected and can "get away with it".......

Apparently I have heard of an ex-PGDB member.....one who pontificated on my situation......cost him 40k I was told.....I don't think he fought it as I have (because I know I am innocent).......

Makes you wonder eh?

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Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #801 on: April 03, 2018, 10:35:41 AM »
April 9th 2009....a man nearly died and my whole world was turned up side down and has stayed that way since.

I was made a scape goat for something I had warned would happen for 6 years before it happened, warning of dodgy certs covering dangerous altered work....

My warnings could not have been better tailored to what happened...the PGDB had gifted a full license to someone who had never done an apprenticeship, they accepted (but later denied ever having received this cert... even though a copy is on their website!) an incomplete certificate (missing a test for gas leaks)...which exploded...all of my install was altered, the PGDB hid the photos that showed this and lets not forget the hose that caused the explosion was sold long after I left....so a very dodgy cert covering altered dangerous work exploded....its about as dangerous as it gets...

The PGDB appointed the same person who gifted the full certifying license as the Impartial investigator....lol.

The PGDB even used one of my letters of warning to sample my handwriting for my signature.....so they could pin the certs that I had warned about ....on me......


Just look at who knows all this.....and it appears don't care.....

Someone recently asked a visiting US President...."how do you handle the guilt?"........my meagre advise from a lowly tradesman in answer to that question......"don't do anything that your conscience tells you is bad, do the right thing, don't do anything that makes you feel guilty" .....


From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 3 April 2018 8:33 a.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Winston Peters'; 'Kaitlin Ruddock'
Subject: RE: PGDB reply to my complaints 2018 03 13

Hi All,


Please can I get some sort of reply from those who are meant to over see all of this (obviously not the PGDB, I have their take on it, it is accompanied by a very large and lumpy carpet).


I am confused by Martins quote in this news story in the link below when you know what he is happy to ignore when it comes to these documents attached. It seems there is a hypocritical stance when you compare my story (1st attachment), with the hearing (2nd attachment).…I understand you already have these attachments that I have sent before, but I have included them for context, it is in light of these attachments that I am asking you to look at the story and comments in the link below.

https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/property/102664221/wave-of-dodgy-building-materials-sparks-mbie-review

These are people’s homes. Isn’t there a responsibility to these people to provide a proper robust way of providing these homes? It begs the question, how did we used to get it so right, but now get it so so wrong…think about it we are not progressing, the trades are in decline…..the answer is NOT to import cheap labour nor cheap products…..who controls OUR boarders? You can not even bring in an apple in to NZ without following the proper channels…but you can ship in tons of cheap and inferior products apparently…..but its OK as long as we have a tradesman to blame for installing/using it? Really?

Why aren’t we starting schools of excellence for training our children to build our homes, their own homes of their own futures? The last ten years have been an utter failure and it needs fixing, not brushing under the carpet.

Hypocrites need to be ousted and replaced. Where has the pride gone from our trade? Pride in workmanship and creating things that last? Built with quality in mind and not squeezing out every last drop of profit….which sometimes is done to meet unrealistic governance/compliance and H&S costs. I feel for these guys caught between a rock and a hard place….but then you have the greedy also, what is being done to help the honest and clamp down on the greedy?

We have a housing shortage of 40 to 60 thousand homes (depending on who you listen to, I think its probably more)…you have the fiasco of the CHCH rebuild with homes wrecked by the earthquake, signed off as compliant, but are now already showing signs of faulty work. You have the story above in the link. We have been talking about a shortage of tradesman for literally years. And from my “Brief History” attached see below…

At one time we had independent of the trade, an inspected gas safety system; with inspectors that were financed by the gas supply companies. It was in the company’s interest to get it right because the liability lay with those selling the gas, reinvesting their profits in the common good and safety of the public.
In the early 90’s the rampant ideology and dogma of deregulation came along, putting profit before safety. Doing away with inspectors and putting those making a profit from installing gas in control of quality and safety, whilst weighing this up against their profit margin.
Most are honest and are observing the proper procedures and standards, but apparently there are those that do not. I am told some of the worst that aren’t observing are the ones with “connections”, acting with impunity because they can and have in the past and will until they stop getting away with it.
Within the gasfitting industry this deregulation introduced a self certificate system, with certificates sold by batches identified by a unique cert number sold only to a specific licence holder.
These unique certs had a triple carbon copy of the original handwritten top copy; this top copy was then held by the PGDB. With the subsequent carbon copy then held by the gas supplier, the gasfitter and the customer.
These four independent document depositories was an effective honesty mechanism with a handwritten checkable way of filling the cert in, with a real signature done by hand. This has all gone now.
The onus was moved to the fitter, you might say “as it should”. But now we had the problem of those making a financial gain from the installation of gas, inspecting their own work, with random audits by the PGDB. But even these audits and this more robust self cert system has since proved to be untenable and has ceased.


What will our legacy be what will we leave our kids to live in, does anyone care? The lost HONESTY mechanisms above showed up the PGDB’s maladministration of the certificate system, not forgetting its flippant handing out of full certifying gas licenses to people they favoured, whilst denying more deserving people. Any of this fair?


What do you think this state of affairs above will do to the gasfitting industry, when you look at it in light of what is already showing its head in our cities. Gas is very unforgiving when it decides to let go. Deregulation was a huge mistake….look at what it is doing today; our standards aren’t what they used to be. The greedy are filling their pockets from all of our futures….I do not think this is a good way to go…..

Please tell me what you think…..

Gas is being installed and sold with ALL new gas install work classed as LOW risk in a housing shortage, with no requirement to lodge a copy of a certificate with a independent govt agency/over seer, with each copy made available by an easily manipulated “computer print off”, there is no carbon copy of handwritten information, no unique cert number, certs can be printed off generically by anyone with a printer…. not sold as they were to a licensed certifying gasfitter with a unique license number and unique certificate number……do you think this is a robust system to install a volatile gas under? Is open to abuse?

You’re not selling ice cream or a happy meal.


What message are you sending to the industry when the PGDB are allowed to protect someone that they gifted a full certifying license to with no apprenticeship sat? The industry most definitely knows of this, there are over 68,400 views on this link….

https://www.plumbers.co.nz/forum/fellow-practitioners-update/41/fellow-practitioner-issue-236-dated-12-december-2014/1810/msg11266#msg11266

In six days time the ninth anniversary will come around for this cover up…..what will your legacy be?



Yours with Integrity Paul Gee




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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #802 on: April 03, 2018, 04:44:40 PM »
The way the system is now....

You have well meaning, compliant, health and safety observing proper tradesman......charging to cover costs to adhere to the system....their prices are going up accordingly to cover this....

Then you have the leaches, the ones filling their pockets mirroring the prices of those trying to do the right thing....but cutting corners, printing off certs, not observing H&S....importing cheap materials/labour.....their profit is soaring.....undercutting by a couple of 100 bucks to get the work....I have seen it all........I worked for someone who would ask to see the quotes....didn't even work them out....just under cut by a small margin....he was as busy as....

I can't beat the quote if I can't see it......a large amount of people will always go with the cheapest....fact.

Who is going to thrive....who has more chance of succeeding....who is going to be left in business.....

This is why the system needs a massive overhaul.....I think it helping those it is meant to hold to account....



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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #803 on: April 10, 2018, 08:20:51 AM »



What amazes me is no one has denied what I have said, no one has said I am making it up.....so I can only surmise that these people are happy with this sort of thing to happen....

Apparently our own "new" minister can not help....this reply took months for me to receive....






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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #804 on: April 30, 2018, 09:06:40 PM »



Again....Sorry to hear it happened to my family.....


No one says I am mistaken, no one denies it happened, no one says I am making this up.....but they are all happy to ignore.....

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #805 on: April 30, 2018, 09:11:04 PM »





And the Office for fairness for all......

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #806 on: April 30, 2018, 09:37:44 PM »



I attached the report and the history and the Ombudsman letter....Office for Fairness for All.....as long as it is convenient and no cronies get into trouble.....f**** the innocent and the public.....






______________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Monday, 30 April 2018 9:31 p.m.
To: 'info@ombudsman.parliament.nz'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Winston Peters'; 'Kaitlin Ruddock'
Subject: RE: PGDB reply to my complaints 2018 03 13



Dear Ombudsman,

Please see attached a report complied by the Plumber’s Federation which shows 9 people of interest ignored by the PGDB and the sham of an investigation I was subjected to.

I want to clarify that, with this information attached; the “Office for Fairness for All” is still of the opinion that I was treated fairly and that these documents show fairness, natural justice and if any moral compass is present at all? If I wasn’t treated fairly…..why do you do nothing?

And Martin while I have your ear, please can you reply to my email below?

Yours with Integrity

Paul Gee


________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Wednesday, 28 March 2018 8:01 a.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Winston Peters'; 'Kaitlin Ruddock'
Subject: RE: PGDB reply to my complaints 2018 03 13

Martin,

Please can you or Peter Jackson clarify whether my complaint is trivial, frivolous or vexatious? It can not be all three.

It smacks of the PGDB’s willingness to hide behind policy and rolling out yet another policy to cover this up? Just as you are with my other complaints “falling out side” of the general complaints policy. They are still very valid complaints, if you don’t have a policy to cover it, then make one.

I believe to cover up a near fatal explosion, while protecting the guilty, ignoring huge conflicts of interest, all done at the expense of the innocent, whilst telling untruths to the persons lawyer who was injured in that explosion while he lay in a drug induced coma, done to cover up the PGDB’s maladministration of the certificate system and the flippant handing out of full certifying licenses to the unqualified….totally despicable if not corrupt. That’s my policy and it should be everyone else’s policy that is copied in to this email….or you are happy with this? Are you happy with that long winded sentence, I will take your silence as a yes.

I can prove all of the above, and am happy to provide. It is not trivial, frivolous or vexatious to speak the truth to those that choose to ignore it.

It is not trivial to blow someone up, it is very serious. To want this PROPERLY looked into is not frivolous (the PGDB ignoring 9 people of interest at the hearing). It is not vexatious, I believe it is quite important, even imperative to get to the bottom of this, to expose those covering this up is not stirring up trouble for the sake of it…..its called seeking the truth with integrity and accountability.

I believe the PGDB treated this situation as trivial, by ignoring the huge amount of evidence. The PGDB is to be found acting in a frivolous manner toward a very important duty entrusted to them to protect the NZ public and displayed a nature of being vexatious when they pursued me in the local press after I went 42 out of 44 charges at their kangaroo court as an innocent man (the last charge being utter B.S.).



But it appears these three words only apply to us lowly plebs and not the hypocrites that govern us.




Yours with Integrity Paul Gee





________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 27 March 2018 5:03 p.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Winston Peters'; 'Kaitlin Ruddock'
Subject: PGDB reply to my complaints 2018 03 13

Hi All,

I will let you all decide if my complaints are trivial, frivolous or vexatious as per the letters sent by the PGDB in response to the email below and received by me today….it involves a cover up of a near fatal explosion and the dire state of the gas certificate system and flippant issuing of licenses to people shown preference by the PGDB whilst others more deserving are refused.

I remake these complaints under natural justice or any policy that I need to, to allow you look at this and not cover it up. It is so wrong to cover this up, just plain wrong.

Yours with Integrity Paul Gee

________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 13 March 2018 1:19 p.m.
To: 'Paul & Emma Gee'; 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'Chris Griggs'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'
Subject: RE: OIA request for Handwriting report

Martin,


Please take my email below as a complaint on the use of one of my warnings to pin the near fatal explosion on me (the outrageous outline is found below in my email please regard ALL questions as a complaint)……


So to recap…..


1.   I complain about the ethics on utilising my warning to try to pin the signature on me for the dodgy certs, that those warnings mentioned.

2.   I complain about the person who caused the fire mentioned below.

3.   I complain that Darnley may have been issuing his own certs.

4.   I complain that the PGDB is protecting Darnley.



I would add to that complaint your inaction to this email below. I am of the opinion after reading your policy, that my complaining about your inaction, removes you Martin from dealing with that complaint and ensures it goes before the Board. Just as the PGDB needed to see the report by the Federation, it needs to deal with these complaints in light of this report.

I have attached the PGDB’s own policy on complaints and the report for your convenience and it is under that policy that I make these complaints.

I also guide you to your most recent available agreement, page 5 attached, with the minister (Nick Smith), are the comments about appeals under “Complaints and Discipline” not to be over turned done at all costs…ignoring natural justice?

The policies and agreements that the PGDB ignore at will, whilst pontificating to the public is sickening.

Was my case too late to meet these policies? Yes it was…..but common decency has always existed, along with ethics and natural justice…..do the PGDB need a rule book to show these aspects fundamental to a well meaning humanity?

Yours with Integrity

Paul Gee

________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Thursday, 15 February 2018 8:55 a.m.
To: 'martin@pgdb.co.nz'; 'complaints@pgdb.co.nz'; 'comms@pgdb.co.nz'; 'PGDB Competency Based Licensing'; 'ceo@pgdb.co.nz'; 'exams@pgdb.co.nz'; 'gascerts@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Hannah Neville'; 'jayson@pgdb.co.nz'; 'licensing'; 'overseas@pgdb.co.nz'; 'Registrar'; 'accounts@pgdb.co.nz'
Cc: 'jacinda.ardern@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Andrew Little'; 'Julia Minko'; 'jenny.salesa@parliament.govt.nz'; 'phil.twyford@parliament.govt.nz'; 'Wal Gordon'; 'Allan Day'; 'Colleen Upton'; 'Chris Griggs'; 'lynnmoff'; 'Faculty of Law'; 'Paul Warhurst'
Subject: FW: OIA request for Handwriting report

Martin,

Thank you for the recent handwriting report, attached…..please can you explain the ethics of the PGDB using one of my warning letters, attached (a letter warning about dodgy certs covering dangerous gas work) which was sent 5 years before an explosion nearly killed someone.

This letter was used by the PGDB as a reference document for a handwriting report (a very directed and focused report only on me only, done well before BOTH mine and Darnley’s hearing)  ….trying to pin that explosion on me. Really? Using my warning to try to implicate me for what I was warning about? Then withholding that report, not divulging it until now, after an OIA request?

Why wasn’t any of Darnley’s handwriting/doc’s reviewed….like the cert for the pizza oven (which the PGDB lost) or the actual job card that shows Darnley’s hand for the addition of the fryers that caused the explosion.


The use of this letter is nearly as bad as relying on child molestation case notes to prove probability in a plumbing context, nearly!



All the evidence is here for those who want to look in the email below and evidence attached.




While I have your ear, I am yet to hear from you about the gas caused fire in Nelson where I asked the question in an email, quoted below, on the 20th Jan 2018.

How many fires caused by a gas leak were there in Nelson on that date? This should narrow it down for you…..if there was no investigation (similar to mine) then why not? It made the Notifiable gas accidents report from Energy Safety attached, emphasis on notifiable. The reference I sent in early December was taken from this report.


I have also just recently found out from someone I trust, that Darnley….who most if not all evidence points to for the Milton Street explosion, and is probably involved in the fire above (please can you confirm)….that the reason he was visited (and as a result gifted his full certifying gas license by Hammond with no apprentice sat after one oral exam, by none other than the same Hammond appointed to investigate the explosion)……well he was making up his own certs….on an exemption license….whilst selling gas….(Hammond also lobbied for deregulation form a gas retailers point of view). Confused? Call me on it….I’ll fly up and walk you through the huge amount of evidence.

So to recap…..

1.   Please explain the ethics on utilising my warning to try to pin the signature on me for the dodgy certs.

2.   Confirm who caused the fire.

3.   Was Darnley issuing his own certs

4.   Why are you protecting this man



I have copied in a few PGDB email addresses as I want this email tabled to the PGDB board at its next meeting. I want the perpetual Board take ownership of this debacle, not sweep it under the carpet.

You talk about trust and integrity you inherit the past and leave a legacy for the future with your present.

Injustice is corrupting if it is accepted....even if it is ignored…… it eats away at integrity, opening the doors to the dismantlers of good, just like rust corrupting the integrity of an otherwise strong steel durable structure.....its no plan for the future. 

This is why we don't use this as a template for ongoing success, history tells us corruption ultimately fails and causes chaos.



Yours With Integrity

Paul Gee


________________________________________
From: Paul & Emma Gee [mailto:gspservices@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Wednesday, 14 February 2018 2:42 p.m.
To: 'Allan Day'
Cc: 'Wal Gordon'; 'Colleen Upton'
Subject: RE: OIA request for Handwriting report

Hi Allan,

I have copied in Wal and Colleen so we can see it all in one place.

The sick minded people behind this used one of my “warning” letters so they could pin the signatures on the certificates on me….I distinctly remember that the investigator (investigator he was not) stated that it was all about the signature……ignoring all the different inks and different handwriting.

This two page letter was one that I sent to warn about my concerns over 5 years before the explosion…..mentioned in reference docs for report, i.e. a two page letter stamped 09 01 04 (stamped by the PGDB)…..the letter being dated 06 01 04, the three days difference for it to be delivered to the PGDB and is the only letter I sent around that time.

This letter submitted by the investigator as a sample of my signature to give to the handwriting expert …..if you look at the letter….my concerns were later shown to be very well founded and actually bang on.   



This report then goes on to raising doubt over my involvement, even saying the signatures were different and could have been copied by a skilled person (all be it doubtful)…..The investigator ignoring Darnley involvement totally (please see break down of my findings in my email to Wal).

Not forgetting this report was withheld and I have only just seen it.



Did I get a fair go?


All the Best

Paul







________________________________________
From: Allan Day [mailto:allan-day@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Tuesday, 16 January 2018 10:50 a.m.
To: Paul & Emma Gee
Subject: Re: OIA request for Handwriting report

Hi Paul
Thank you for including me into your email, please keep me advised as to the response.
I have been reading Wal's report/submission and I can tell you I find it upsetting at the injustice of those involved and the wheels with in wheels as they concealed and covered the truth.
Kind regards
Allan



On 15/01/2018, at 11:21 AM, Paul & Emma Gee <gspservices@xtra.co.nz> wrote:

Martin,
 
Please by way of an OIA request can I get a copy of the report from the forensic document examination and handwriting expert who the PGDB contracted to analyse documents for the investigation into the explosion at Milton Street.
 
It is the report that the PGDB were billed for 12 hours of consultation, examination and the resulting report for. The invoice from the handwriting expert was dated 20 September 2010, but as it was part of the investigation it should have been retained until the hearing which is within the 7 years limit.
 
I would have thought a copy would have been made available to me at the time, but it has never been passed on to me and I have never seen a copy. It is within 7 years to the hearing and I can assure you my request is neither frivolous nor am I being vexatious. I do not think the well worn excuse of it’s “too hard to find” is warranted either.
 
A man nearly died in a preventable explosion due to circumstances I had warned about for 6 years before that explosion. My family were terrorised and my life has been in turmoil since.
 
Please Martin do not continue this cover up. Please clear my name and give me my life back. I have done no wrong but my family has paid a hefty price.
 
Thank you
 
Yours with Integrity
Paul Gee


Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #807 on: May 14, 2018, 09:23:28 AM »





If you read only read two things on this fiasco make sure its these two attachments.




.

Offline ford1

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #808 on: June 08, 2018, 11:56:25 AM »
still cant hear anything ! no one saying this guys making this shit up or is telling pork pies ! that tells me that they will do what they want , when they want & we will fund it . no accountability required >:(

Offline Badger

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Re: Fellow Practitioner Issue 236 Dated 12 December 2014
« Reply #809 on: June 09, 2018, 03:19:04 PM »

Exactly Ford1.....75 thousand views, and the link to this page I have sent to the PGDB, politicians, media , the PGDB definitely know its out there, they know its common knowledge....and they do not give a flying Donald duck mate...

Still haven't (because they can't) answered this question below in blue....

Please can you or Peter Jackson clarify whether my complaint is trivial, frivolous or vexatious? It can not be all three.


It sets a precedent....anyone of you can get shafted and they can get away with it.....


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